Passing Spades

User avatar
lastrahm
Active Poster
Posts: 60
Joined: Fri Mar 28, 2003 5:03 pm
Location: Nevada

Passing Spades

Post by lastrahm » Wed May 09, 2007 11:45 am

I seem to be getting a number of partners that get mad at me for not passing spades when I am nil. I feel there are exceptions to this that some people may disagree with such as having a 3 card suit and two of the following: Queen, King, Ace. I pass the highest card to get some assurance the lower one will be covered especially if what spades I do have are the low ones.

What I don't understand is why I am getting accused of not passing spades when I was never dealt any in that hand. How does one pass what they don't have? I wish I wasn't serious but it is amazing how often this happens. :shock:
LAS

User avatar
grandmaS
Grand Master
Posts: 5705
Joined: Mon Nov 25, 2002 4:23 pm
Location: Washington State
Contact:

Post by grandmaS » Wed May 09, 2007 12:25 pm

Hi Las, it happens from time to time that your pard who can't see your cards thinks your stupid enough to not know how to pass. Had you held that A, and passed say a 4 of spades and gone set then they would have been mad at that too LOL

Not too many are this way but they make themselves very memorable, so if you run into a couple in the course of a month it feels like everyone is getting that way.

I had a pard once well for a short time LOL who constantly thought he knew how to play them me and would YELL at me. I asked him twice not to do this or to not ask me to pard him, third time I stopped parding him. I have since found out that there are lots of people who won't pard him and some were amazed I put up with it as long as I did LOL

OK ok I am an optimist hoping I could get him to see in replays that I had played what I had and that if I didn't have the A to cover his lone King I couldn't play it etc. But some are just to stuburn to see what is there in front of them.

As a guide I get called to tables for this type of thing from time to time. My best advice is...........DON"T PLAY WITH THEM ANYMORE, and yes I did take my own advice :)

Hugs and Smiles
Image

I am woman I am strong

User avatar
Galt
Grand Master
Posts: 1484
Joined: Tue Nov 26, 2002 10:57 am
Contact:

Post by Galt » Wed May 09, 2007 3:48 pm

Grandma, just cause you don't have it doesn't mean that you shouldn't play it... common.
Image

User avatar
Dust In The Wind
Guide
Posts: 5343
Joined: Wed Feb 09, 2005 1:29 pm
Location: North Ga Mts

Post by Dust In The Wind » Wed May 09, 2007 5:05 pm

Keep a spare deck up your sleave and then you can pick whatever your pard (like that one) wants you to play......


JUST DUST
TO BE OR NOT TO BE..... NOW WHAT KIND OF QUESTION IS THAT??? TO BE OF COURSE!!!!!

User avatar
Tater
Active Poster
Posts: 208
Joined: Fri Sep 03, 2004 8:41 am
Location: At the computer

Post by Tater » Wed May 09, 2007 7:05 pm

A lot of peeps get crossed if you don't pass Spades no matter what you have to do if you can insure ur Nil, take it with a grain of salt.Image
Image

User avatar
lastrahm
Active Poster
Posts: 60
Joined: Fri Mar 28, 2003 5:03 pm
Location: Nevada

Passing Spades

Post by lastrahm » Wed May 09, 2007 7:50 pm

OK, I see and appreciate everyone's comments. But, to get mad because I don't pass what I don't have seems like they have lost their minds. I have gotten accused of costing us the game because I didn't pass spades. What spades? Maybe I have lost my mind. :shock:
LAS

TheShadowMan
Posts: 8
Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2005 11:15 am

Passing Spades

Post by TheShadowMan » Mon May 14, 2007 6:12 am

You know your hand your pard does not. So when you make the decsion to pass what cards to insure your nil and pard does not like it to bad.

Like you pointed out if you are short suited in a suite and you have the ace king queen and that is it in that suit then yes pass them. Hopefully you will low in spades.

Also some pards get upset if you don't go nil in a pass 2 game. Again you know your hand and what the chances are of making nil. The only suggestion I would give in that sitution is that your pard probabley bid on the assumption you are going to go nil and pass him a trick or two. So underbid your hand so you don't go set.

User avatar
Ralphie May
Active Poster
Posts: 123
Joined: Sat Feb 28, 2004 3:07 pm
Location: Chattanooga TN
Contact:

Post by Ralphie May » Mon May 14, 2007 9:52 am

Everyhand is a different situation so what I choose to pass to my partner depends on the following factors:

1.Total table bid
2.Score
3.Security of my nil


Disclaimer-I get worked over by old ladies in a pass room, so this pass advice might be less then solid.
Image

User avatar
Dust In The Wind
Guide
Posts: 5343
Joined: Wed Feb 09, 2005 1:29 pm
Location: North Ga Mts

Post by Dust In The Wind » Mon May 14, 2007 5:14 pm

I agree Ralphie, play what makes sense to make the NIL successful.

JUST DUST

PS - most of the time includes passing spades if pass game. I usually do not play pass.
TO BE OR NOT TO BE..... NOW WHAT KIND OF QUESTION IS THAT??? TO BE OF COURSE!!!!!

INNRabbit
Posts: 8
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2007 4:39 pm
Location: right here
Contact:

passing?

Post by INNRabbit » Sun Oct 21, 2007 5:37 pm

here is your simple answer, never play in a game where passing cards is part of it, cause if you do it isnt spades, its some silly variation... heck one person can go nil every hand nearly with the ability to pass cards..

if you want to pass cards, play hearts..... dont mess up spades
fear is never boring

User avatar
grandmaS
Grand Master
Posts: 5705
Joined: Mon Nov 25, 2002 4:23 pm
Location: Washington State
Contact:

Post by grandmaS » Sun Oct 21, 2007 6:41 pm

variety is the spice of life, don't judge one person's preference by your own to the elimination of all others.
Image

I am woman I am strong

Razler
Grand Master
Posts: 1322
Joined: Fri Jan 03, 2003 6:54 am
Location: Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

Re: passing?

Post by Razler » Sun Oct 21, 2007 6:41 pm

INNRabbit wrote:here is your simple answer, never play in a game where passing cards is part of it, cause if you do it isnt spades, its some silly variation... heck one person can go nil every hand nearly with the ability to pass cards..

if you want to pass cards, play hearts..... dont mess up spades
Ya don't like it, don't play it.

FYI
I agree with what Ralphie said 10,000 %
Image
Image here's to the day!!

Vidurr
Active Poster
Posts: 173
Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2005 9:54 am

Re: passing?

Post by Vidurr » Sun Oct 21, 2007 6:57 pm

INNRabbit wrote:here is your simple answer, never play in a game where passing cards is part of it, cause if you do it isnt spades, its some silly variation... heck one person can go nil every hand nearly with the ability to pass cards..

if you want to pass cards, play hearts..... dont mess up spades
There was a very good article last month in one of the Gaming Blogs. The focus was on card games.

The one constant that card games offer is the randomness of the deal. It's what attracts people to card games and it is also what players complain about. The article reviews several methods players have tried to overcome randomness.

So what options are there to "solve" randomness of the deal?

Some say the answer is duplicate like in bridge. Where everybody plays the same set of cards. Others think duplicate is too different, too complicated and takes away "the game" approach to spades with a "hand" or bridge approach.

Time is another factor. It's also been talked about here many times. If you play one game vs. 100 games. The randomness should have less effect as compared to a a single game or 5 games. The same applies to the number of hands in a game or the point total that is played too. The greater the number of hands or the higher the point total; the effect of a single bad hand may be minimized.

But the article also addressed three other factors; value assessment, hand refinement and card play.

Value assessment is the art of bidding or placing a value to the cards that are dealt you. Spades is not "War" where you just throw out your high cards and count up who took the most cards. In spades you must also bid those tricks to have them count.

Hand refinement is the introduction of passing cards such as in spades and hearts. Got a bad hand? Got a good hand? Passing gives another opportunity to even the cards out. But as the original poster suggests, it also adds another level of complexity. What was passed and why? Signals can also be derived from the pass. Not just pass two spades; but what does the partner pass in return? Just their two lowest? I think not.

Card play is the art of following and understanding voids, leads, maybe even signals derived from the actual cards played etc...

All these methods are meant to overcome the randomness of the deal.

If one plays "pass" as strictly pass the spades and bid nil; they are probably missing out on alot of other opportunities and I would guess losing some games that could be won.

Pass is still spades. It's just a different variation and a means to overcome randomness or lopsided deals. It can "even" the deal.

Openshut
Active Poster
Posts: 59
Joined: Tue Dec 05, 2006 3:56 am

Post by Openshut » Mon Oct 22, 2007 3:40 am

What many don't seem to realize is that we are not to overcome randomness but try to predict events based on the clues we have in hand. The notion of passing 2 cards cannot be considered a strong meaningful game as even a strong 5-7 hand can become a very nice nil with the passing of 2 cards. The whole concept is ridiculous.
To the originator of this thread however the simple answer is to consider that your partner/s are correct and see if this improves your win loss ratio. Maybe passing 2 spades is excessive or impractical, but consider the reality that your partner/s will be facing more spades power; on a consistent basis over a virgin deal. As this is a reality of your game, you gotta do as the Romans do when in Rome at least.

HEXA
Grand Master
Posts: 2050
Joined: Sat Jan 31, 2004 1:19 am
Location: Topeka, Kansas

Post by HEXA » Mon Oct 22, 2007 5:08 am

Start playing No Pass, instead :lol:

You chose the best pass based on your hand, in my opinion.
In the pass games, your partner is probably bidding an extra trick or two based on what he thinks you will pass (spades usually). The only way to win at pass two games, is not only setting the other team's nil (in pass games there is a nil almost every hand, why wouldnt there be when you can dump two cards) But also setting the other team's bidding hand. Or outbidding them, Getting spades from your partner when he nils seems to be the way to do this. When your pard passes to you, he is probably ridding himself of suits you just passed him, He cant trump the suit if he has it in his hand (again).

Pass is not my game of choice :roll:


xox
Hexa
Image
The beauty of a woman grows with the passing years.

Post Reply