Hearts….. The way it was meant to be!

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dadiomac
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Hearts….. The way it was meant to be!

Post by dadiomac » Wed Jul 16, 2008 2:02 am

I just posted this comment in a thread titled "money back" and I feel that it deserves it's own thread.

My opinion:

It’s like my Mother used to always tell me….

“It’s not whether you win or lose its how you play the game”

The way the game of hearts is meant to be played is:

1) Cover your pass!

2) Always play to hit low… if that means that you eat the Queen trying then fine.. That’s the way it is!
(Only exception is if you eating the queen would end the game or if the score is seriously lob sited)

3) Never lead spades to low (if lowman is sitting to your right then that means you should not lead spades) by doing so it give the low person the advantage of getting rid of the ace or king if he/she is holding it. Leading spades to low also increases the chance of any person before low having to play the ace or king of spades and getting dumped on by the low person.

4) Never lead low’s void (this means if clubs are led and the lowman plays a diamond then don’t lead clubs anymore)

5) Have a nice day! :D

Hearts is a cut throat game and the majority of players are very passionate about how the game is played. That’s only because we care and are frustrated that the game as we have always known it to be is fading away.

Here at Heardwood you can find the best graphics, a fair amount of players of which a small percentage truly understand the roots of what this game is about.
How about a mandatory tutorial about how the game is meant to be played???? What about a room for lowman hearts?
So much has been put into this website and numerous variations of hearts have been developed here. And for that I applaud Hardwood.

What has been done to preserve the integrity of the game? Absolutely NOTHING!!!!!! That is why so many are easily frustrated.

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Dust In The Wind
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Re: Hearts….. The way it was meant to be!

Post by Dust In The Wind » Thu Jul 17, 2008 1:43 am

I don't have an answer to your questions here since none of us can control how players play other than offers to show them how (the right way) to play. You can offer a social game for those that wish to learn but you cannot force them to join or force them to see things in a new light. I have spent many hours teaching players in all variations of the game. Still some players will panic when they have the queen or when they see someone leading spades. I would suggest one of the leagues we have here depending on your choice of game and try them on for size. You may find they play the way you wish and you can meet players that play the way you do and you now have players that will join you in the common rooms for a good game.

Yes, players that panic, play for vengence, don't really know the concept, learned to play a different way, whatever, can make your day here not to your expectations. I find I adjust to the players that are at the table, I will try to get lowman and I will be going for the win, not second, not third and not forth. Yes it can be frustrating and my monitor can tell you how much sometimes, but I don't let it get to me.... I find another table.

JUST DUST

PS - I prefer a game that goes to the last hand and all players have the chance to win, that's what I call a good game.

PS - If I do get frustrated I just play a game against Da BOT's, they are easy, predictable and can't make any remarks back to me no matter what I say to them. You can also zap them and never see "What you do that for??"
Last edited by Dust In The Wind on Tue Jul 22, 2008 6:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
TO BE OR NOT TO BE..... NOW WHAT KIND OF QUESTION IS THAT??? TO BE OF COURSE!!!!!

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Re: Hearts….. The way it was meant to be!

Post by U.S. Marshall » Tue Jul 22, 2008 4:46 pm

I agree with Dust and understand your point of view. But I can tell you a lot of players at hardwood do not like to be told how to play even if it is for their own good. Going in the lobby and ranting you must play lowman rules to play in this game doesn't go over very well, or being in a game and complaining cause someone dumped the queen on you isn't well recieved either. I for one always go for low man if I can but if I am passed the queen and have 1 or 2 other spades, I will dump her unless I can afford to eat her and not get put over the score limit.
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Re: Hearts….. The way it was meant to be!

Post by dadiomac » Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:11 am

Yes.... I completely understand where you are coming from. And that goes back to an old saying

"If you always do what you have always done you will always get what you have always got"

There is no incentive at hardwood for anyone to seriously care about playing to get lowman. As long as 2nd and 3rd place are rewarded nothing will ever change!

Show me in the history of hearts where anything other than first is rewarded! I have been playing hearts for over 25 years and It has always been understood (common sense) that only 1st place matters…. That is until I began playing at hardwood. Don’t get me wrong…. I love Hardwood/Silvercreek I just wish that they would take some pride in the history of the game. As much as I love it I would gladly trade in all of the fooms, and graphics for the ability to consistently find a good game of hearts!

For anyone that is true to the game of hearts lowman the only way to play and anything else is pure disappointment! Sure you can suggest that a person goes to some special room or tournament to play lowman hearts…. However the times for those games are limited and not always convenient or possible.

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Re: Hearts….. The way it was meant to be!

Post by Dust In The Wind » Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:27 am

Then find a group of players within hearts that play that format, I did and we played all the time for hours same group and we always had fun. Plan a time frame that you all like to play and I bet you find more players that will join your "club". I'm always looking for good lowman players and I know there are others out there.

JUST DUST
TO BE OR NOT TO BE..... NOW WHAT KIND OF QUESTION IS THAT??? TO BE OF COURSE!!!!!

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Re: Hearts….. The way it was meant to be!

Post by MookGeorgia » Mon Aug 04, 2008 11:35 am

YO, Been a member of Hardwood for several Years, Only have just taken the time to register on SilverCreek...

I agree wholeheartedly with Dust, his comments , and most importantly a LOW Man LOBBY....

also a lot of the Kiddies (and even growups who play that way) Probably would go ape over a DUMPERS lobby also.
I'd never ever visit that lobby , but i'd bet it would be very popular, put both under SMOOTS .. and away you go..

MOON hearts, would have two lobbies and we PURISts would probably see a lot of better games...

I'm former, Mplayer, (now LIVVE.com) GamesSpy player (until they got too big for hearts) so i've been playing hearts online for quite a while now.

love Hardwwood... and i still Miss Microphones inside the rooms, text in the lobby but Microphones inside the rooms. that was a great feature.

also miss being able to NAME a room... i.e. LOW man , etc.. that also might be an answer to this one... don't post the player names , just name the room and post the HOST / name...

IT may be dreaming, Dust , but a good and adroit post anyway. kudos.

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Re: Hearts….. The way it was meant to be!

Post by Dust In The Wind » Mon Aug 04, 2008 6:15 pm

There are microphones in the rooms..... oooppppssss sorry, Jonas.... LOL

See the other post for some suggestions on how to get a group together, I love a good lowman game and would love to play when not Blue, not guide duties involved.

JUST DUST
TO BE OR NOT TO BE..... NOW WHAT KIND OF QUESTION IS THAT??? TO BE OF COURSE!!!!!

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Re: Hearts….. The way it was meant to be!

Post by drbob » Thu Aug 07, 2008 3:28 am

I appreciated this discussion. And I ate up the tips Dadiomac posted. I'm not real good at this game, and I have quite often been honestly puzzled when one of the players in the game suddenly starts name-calling, as though I did something to them with malice. I've no problem playing like an accidental dummy, but it's no fun catching some stranger's spittle.
Anyway, if there were a book that could teach me how to play better, I'd get it. And thanks again, Dadiomac, for the pointers you posted. Good stuff for us double-digit-rating folks. :-)
Robert
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Re: Hearts….. The way it was meant to be!

Post by Dust In The Wind » Thu Aug 07, 2008 9:47 am

If you look around there are some other very good pointers in this forum under this index (hearts) I have posted many and have played this game for a long time. There are also some good books out there but they will not teach you some of the optional games played here. Getting with a player that is willing to teach you is the best way. Watch some of the games played. Replay the games you have played (you can see all the cards in replay) and observe tactics, not all are good but you can still learn what works and what doesn't. Part of the game is deception, making it look like a moon when it isn't to distribute the points else where's. And on the flip-side pull the moon when they least expect it. All this depends on the type of game your playing and partners is a whole diff. animal in itself.

JUST DUST
TO BE OR NOT TO BE..... NOW WHAT KIND OF QUESTION IS THAT??? TO BE OF COURSE!!!!!

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Re: Hearts….. The way it was meant to be!

Post by drbob » Fri Aug 08, 2008 3:22 am

Thanks, Dust.
Robert
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Re: Hearts….. The way it was meant to be!

Post by Joe Andrews » Sat Aug 09, 2008 6:57 am

Great thread!

I have always advocated "Low Man" Hearts; however, there are so few players who believe in this philosophy. However, the tide is turning. A dedicated "Low Man forum will be helpful. And I can understand the frustration of players who are victimized by the "duckers and dumpers" who give up Moons, or make no effort to aim for Low Man. As for name calling, there is no need for that. I guess it is easy for some "Knights of the Keyboard" to sit anonymously in front of their computers and spew venom and rambling diatribes on fellow players. Ugh! It's only a game! Name calling is not tolerated at Grand Prix "live" events, and that includes all of the card games.

As for books on Hearts, I suggest that you check out -

"The Complete Win At Hearts" by yours truly. It was written in 1983, and revised in 2001 when Bicycle cards bought the rights. I don't think there are any other Hearts books out there - if someone knows of one - let me know! :P
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Re: Hearts….. The way it was meant to be!

Post by Poppysmom » Wed Aug 20, 2008 9:06 am

As a complete novice who would like to really learn the game I have a couple of questions from the posts I have read.
How do you "cover your pass?"
What is meant by lowman?
How do you "play to hit low?"

I have some thoughts on what these mean but would like to hear from the experts.

Also why would someone get upset if you dump the queen of spades? Surely you don't want to risk being left holding the baby if there is no chance of your taking all the tricks? Am I missing something here? It's very difficult to find anything that really lays out strategy.

I have only played against the robots - much too intimidated to play real bodies; especially after reading the posts from you purists. I get loaded down with diamonds nine times out of ten and every hand I either get the A,K and/or the queen of spades or they are passed to me. Also two other players either have no clubs or no diamonds. It seems to happen way more often than it would in the normal course of events. When you play with live bodies how is the dealing of the cards handled?

You are probably rolling on the floor at such naive questions but what the hec! If I don't ask I won't know. :)

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Re: Hearts….. The way it was meant to be!

Post by Dust In The Wind » Wed Aug 20, 2008 2:20 pm

1) Cover your pass - is making sure that you don't pass a moon to the player YOU are passing cards to. If you were to pass AKQ of hearts it would be an uncovered pass since you cannot take any of those cards and you may have passed a moon to that player. However if you passed JQK and kept the A to cover if it appears they are going to attempt a moon AND you do use that A to stop such an attempt then you are covering your pass. You passed and cover that pass. Once points are split between 2 players you have covered your pass.

2) Lowman - Lowman is where whom ever has the low score, the other 3 players make an ATTEMPT to give that player points until they are no longer lowman and then those 3 player ATTEMPT to give the NEW lowman point until they are no longer lowman and so on until the game comes to an end with all players being somewhat even until then. It's called making it a game to the end.

NOTE: of course the lowman is under no obligation to play lowman since he/she knows they are the target and is trying to finish the game as lowman and will attempt to put highman out for the win. Also note that lowman could also be lowwoman.

3) How to "HIT Lowman" - that is all strategy in finding an opportunity to get the queen or as many points as possible to the lowman or new lowman. Lots of ways to do this but most of all is watching the cards and lead to their most damaging suit and if you passed 3 cards to them then you have an opportunity to know which suit that is. This only works if all the players are paying attention to see where you are leading. Also not jumping the gun to throw the queen EVEN if highman puts down the king or queen of spades knowing your holding queen for lowman. Hearts is a game of strategy and placing points where they need to go to better your position in the game towards first (lowman) without ending the game before that is accomplished. SOMETIMES you eat points or in the game with the JoD give that -40 to the highman to extend your chances to win. You may even allow a moon by the highman to accomplish this goal. A common mistake that I have seen recently is the one where P&P (Pass and Pull) is claimed in the case of getting the lowman, this is accomplishing the mission of getting lowman and I will do it every time I have an opportunity because it serves the purpose, taking lowman out of that spot.

NOTE: There has NEVER been a rule on P&P or dumping points, HOWEVER, it is smart play to do both on the lowman at that time and change it when there is another lowman..... unless of course YOU are that lowman and going for the win.

Hearts is a mean game... DUMP THE QUEEN, DROP POINTS, MOON THE OTHERS, etc. BUT remember it is a GAME!!!

JUST DUST

PS - A good lowman game is the best of games if played right and enjoyable for all win or lose since everyone had a chance at the end and it was only luck of the cards combined with skill to get that last hand win. HINT: Deception is also part of the game... make it look like your mooning when not, look like you have the queen when it's to your right, etc.

PS - Sorry about the long answer, just trying to answer the question.
TO BE OR NOT TO BE..... NOW WHAT KIND OF QUESTION IS THAT??? TO BE OF COURSE!!!!!

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Re: Hearts….. The way it was meant to be!

Post by Poppysmom » Wed Aug 20, 2008 3:19 pm

Thank you for that response. Answered my questions, confirmed some things I have been thinking and gave me food for more thought.
Much appreciated. :)
Poppysmom

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