Loppy Tables

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Dust In The Wind
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Re: Loppy Tables

Post by Dust In The Wind » Thu Oct 16, 2008 7:41 pm

They have answered it, several times, the generator is the same as it was and has been random from the start. I do not have a problem with it and just play the cards dealt.

But the server likes me too, I leave it bits and bytes to eat at night......

JUST DUST
TO BE OR NOT TO BE..... NOW WHAT KIND OF QUESTION IS THAT??? TO BE OF COURSE!!!!!

Terry Brett
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Re: Loppy Tables

Post by Terry Brett » Thu Oct 16, 2008 7:46 pm

7's up deck, game to 11pts (as per the live deck, scoring is using the 6 and 5 cards in real life), loners (a march) is 3pts, euchres 2 pts, contract made (but not all tricks) 1 pt..............damned simple!!!

Lets do it and then I don't have to read any more about loppy deals.......

The above were the original rules, not the doctored ones.


C'mon Support, Jonas, Unicron and all other wonderful wizards of Silvercreek, get it together and make us, the moaning masses happy.

Your product is extremely good, this will make it better!
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Dust In The Wind
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Re: Loppy Tables

Post by Dust In The Wind » Thu Oct 16, 2008 7:49 pm

Now I do agree that making 7up's an option would tend to help with loners to some degree and would be a much better option than to doctor the random deal generator.

JUST DUST
TO BE OR NOT TO BE..... NOW WHAT KIND OF QUESTION IS THAT??? TO BE OF COURSE!!!!!

card player 1
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Re: Loppy Tables

Post by card player 1 » Thu Oct 16, 2008 9:23 pm

So Dust in the Wind you are contradicting yourself. First you say you believe Silvercreek when they say the deal generator is truly random. But then you say you would like the 7up option to help with the loner problem going on at Silvercreek. So then you think there are too many loners which would be a fault in the deal generator. So I thank you for helping prove our point!!!!!!!!

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Dust In The Wind
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Re: Loppy Tables

Post by Dust In The Wind » Thu Oct 16, 2008 9:47 pm

No Card player I did not say the random generator is wrong I said the 7ups would make it a more competitive game. I have played both and have always thought 7ups was better.

FYI - I deal with random generators in my day-to-day job in the lottery bus. both online and printed tickets (online games like KENO) so I do know how random generators work. Yep have programed RRG's.

There are no little green men saying Card is playing so we must make sure that he/she loses today or that Dust is playing and must let him win with 3 loners at the end of the game to make Card MAD as a hornet.

What was offered was that SCE "MAY" decide to generate an option to "Cheat" the random generator so it throws out those hands that are unusual so the game can be competitive on the level you are looking for. I for one will not play that game random is random and I do very well as it is.

So didn't prove any point that you insist that they are cheating you at the table, I feel maybe more study in the game maybe required. (I do fine with the same cards with 1600 and up and I enjoy the games).

JUST DUST
TO BE OR NOT TO BE..... NOW WHAT KIND OF QUESTION IS THAT??? TO BE OF COURSE!!!!!

card player 1
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Re: Loppy Tables

Post by card player 1 » Thu Oct 16, 2008 10:04 pm

Not once have I said or hinted that any hand I may get was because who I was or that there was a conspiracy theory against me.

Approximately 1/2 hour ago I created a new thread with a poll asking people to vote and give their opinion whether the cards were being dispersed correctly or fairly with the random generator. I was being humorus and titled the thread "In the Spirit of the Presidential Election" and said you dont have to a US citizen to vote, because I know people from other countries play here. So guess what happens? GRANDMA deletes my thread because she said it was political in nature. Did you even read the post GRANDMA? There was nothing political about it. Go back and read it. Then apologize to me and repost it. This is second time I have had a topic/response deleted. Not one contained any questionable or foul language.

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Dust In The Wind
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Re: Loppy Tables

Post by Dust In The Wind » Thu Oct 16, 2008 10:33 pm

Maybe just label it "Vote On Random Cards Yes OR No"

and then nothing political and nothing wrong with the post.

JUST DUST

PS - I have heard a few people actually say they server picks them out of the 200 players and gives them bad cards.
TO BE OR NOT TO BE..... NOW WHAT KIND OF QUESTION IS THAT??? TO BE OF COURSE!!!!!

The Zee
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Re: Loppy Tables

Post by The Zee » Tue Oct 21, 2008 9:31 pm

Hi peeps,

I totally agree with what you're all saying here. With the 9up deck, Loppy tables are a regular part of HW and are here to stay. Its not the random generator thats the problem, its the fact that with the 9up deck, the deals get one sided. I played in the Vegas 08 Tournament, and lost 9 straight games due to Loppy tables and they wern't dealt by a random generator ( so ya cant blame that ).

The way to get it sorted is to have 7up decks as an option, as the deals are more random. I had the pleasure of playing a few games of 7up with Tony, Lora, Dewayne, Bonnie and Terri at the Las Vegas grand prix and to see the look of their faces with the cards they were getting ( nice 4 of a kind in 7's Dewayne :lol: ) and how they could score with such crap cards was priceless.

I think Jonas needs to start taking the people on this site serious, we are getting fed up with it. We have been asking for this as an option for years now. I know a lot of people here in NZ and Aussie that would play on this site if 7ups was an OPTION ( OPTION - not a set thing, just an option ). I also know a lot of people here that will leave if a site offers the 7up deck.

Food for thought Jonas: This is your business and at the end of the day, you run it as you see fit. However like any business, you gotta keep the customers happy or they'll go elsewhere.

Matty Zee

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Re: Loppy Tables

Post by scania charlie » Mon Oct 27, 2008 4:52 am

I play from 7 up and with the benny(joker)also where the dealer has the chance of last call but dont lets go there in the uk all the time in real life and the game is so much better , will it it stop loppy tables I very much doubt it and after getting hands of 7's and 8'and 9's I can see some real moaning going on can't you .This sudject has been bought up so many times and its still the same nothing will change I guess the clue is in random.I agree it is a shame I play less now than I use to some on here now are saying thankyou for that but thats got nothing to do with the hands Im getting dealt lol,more to do with the fact thats there is far to much instant messageing going on i guess that evens out loppy tables :( may I suggest you do what i do watch several games first or play with 1 nic and if the tables seem "sensible " get out the nic you really want to play with and keep your fingers crossed :lol:
stay lucky in love,life and cards

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Re: Loppy Tables

Post by Dust In The Wind » Mon Oct 27, 2008 6:46 am

Yep Scania I use that very same method myself, test the water, if it's fine go get the bathing suit and jump in, Otherwise sit on the beach and enjoy the sun.

JUST DUST
TO BE OR NOT TO BE..... NOW WHAT KIND OF QUESTION IS THAT??? TO BE OF COURSE!!!!!

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GTO RACER
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Re: Loppy Tables

Post by GTO RACER » Fri Oct 31, 2008 7:54 am

I have always trusted Jonas's statements about the randomnes... but let me tell you it has been insane this week.

Seriously this does not EVER happen in real life.

8 games in a row I was down, opponent on 9, me in loner range. Won all 8 games in a row with a dead blonde hand loner. 8 IN A ROW>

Then!

9 opponent.. me WHATEVER..

Their deal... J upcard everytime.... 6 games in a row.

Seriously :(
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Re: Loppy Tables

Post by Dreamy_Madness » Fri Oct 31, 2008 8:43 am

I am so tired of playing with loopy tables. I would not tell any of my friends to come here and play and waste their money. I just left a table score was 10 to 0 and the game before the score was 11 to 2. Now what is wrong with this picture. I may host on this site but til something is done I am done playing on this site and most definatley won't recommend it to my friends.

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Re: Loppy Tables

Post by DragonsRath » Fri Oct 31, 2008 9:01 am

I have to AGREE. The tables have become so loppy that it isnt fun to play even if you are on the winning side. Come on you cant tell me the card generated doesnt need to be fixed. I have played in two Live euchre tournaments and never saw scores like 11-2, 11-3,10-0.10-2. Those types of scores are unrealistic. We are losing members everyday due to this. Poeple are saying i cant win in this room and im not coming back. Well it just isnt one room,it is all all the rooms, and eventually everyone will find a different site to play in. Is that what you want Silvercreek? All i hear you say is theres nothing wrong with the card genereator. Well come to euchre and find out. Play a few days and see how you actually like it. Experience it, then tell me it is OK.

DragonsRath HTD Dreamweavers

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Re: Loppy Tables

Post by CitySlider » Fri Oct 31, 2008 9:54 am

guess im done here with playing !!! the last 3 days i played in 12 tourneys and all games ALL ends with 11/10 - 0 or 2. im playing at many pages (VU Games, Game Desire and so on) but what i see here isnt normal. this server progam NEEDS to be fixed asap. im sure its over 9 years old and the programmers should start doing her job. if they cant, i know some that would be glad to fix it and the loppy tables would be history.

City

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Re: Loppy Tables

Post by Sailing_Away » Fri Oct 31, 2008 10:09 am

From a programmer's perspective..... I have coded random number generators before. One method I have used considers decimal values on a CPU timestamp function to be random. I tend to believe, then, that this random card selector is probably coded to be purely random and that the distribution across all 52 cards is even, but something in the logic for selecting subsequent cards after card number 1 may need some adjusting. Testing the distribution stats given you have a certain starting card or given two cards may begin to skew off an even distribution. If I were the programmer here and I heard these complaints, I would begin to look at how I select each of the following cards to ensure the results were as close to evenly spread as possible (1:52, 1:51, 1:50, etc... 1:1).

One other thing to consider... maybe in fact the distribution *is* as close to the odds as I stated them, but in real lfe you never get a pure shuffle. Some of the cards that ended up together at play's end still have a chance to be in proximity when re-dealt, which may be a natural means to avoid loppy tables. Perhaps this "real world" affect can be programmed into the Euchre game?

As much as this is complained about in Euchre, I don't see such a problem in Hearts. Perhaps it's the nature of the way the cards are dealt... it's impossible to see the effects of non-randomness on a dealt hearts deck. If a change is made for how cards are picked for dealing in Euchre, I wouldn't necessarily want to see the same thing done in Hearts.
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