The G with some Basics.

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Terry Brett
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Post by Terry Brett » Thu May 31, 2007 4:32 pm

Hi AB, I actually was just making it a hypothetical,,,food for thought rather than an actual deal situation, but since you asked......

I would prefer it to be a 'NEXT' situation where Spades have been turned down, however, the hand has a nice feel to it and depending on score I would be inclined to call anyway. I'd make my apologies later if need be :)
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Post by callme7 » Thu May 31, 2007 4:51 pm

I go to bed and wake up, and there is another page here to read, good stuff Girls and Boys, keep it going. I thought we might have had a couple of very good Terry jokes in here by now. :lol:

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Post by American Beauty » Fri Jun 01, 2007 9:14 am

Terry, If I was sitting in 1st seat and Spades was turned down, I would definitely pick this up with a Next call. It's pretty classic.

I would lead out with my low trump, expecting that my partner has the bower. Some might lead out with the Ace of Spades, but I feel this would be a mistake, seeing Spades was turned down, making it likely to be trumped even though it was a singleton.

Anyone else?
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Post by American Beauty » Fri Jun 01, 2007 10:23 am

I certainly don't mean to offend anyone when I said that there is a difference between provisional games and higher-rated games. But there is.

And one of the big faults I see in higher-rated games is over-blocking.

I just played 2 games with Tony the Stud, against 2 other experienced players; we were all rated high 16's.

I watched the replay on these games because I found them noteworthy.

In the first game there was 3 loner attempts, 2 made by myself, and 1 by my opponents, which didn't go through, obviously. 1 successful block was made by my opponents against myself and 1 unsuccessful one. The unsuccessful one put us at the score 8/9 their lead. They called next hand; we euchred them and won.

*Note: that bad block gave us the game, IMO.

2nd game: 5 loner attempts! and not one of them went through. The last one was in desperation because of the score was 9/4 in our favor, and we were able to euchred them.

My point: in 2 games, 8 loners were attempted and failed. Watching the replay it was easy to see that anyone would have attempted with the hands that were being dealt, but each time the opponents had that one blasted stopper.

Also note that 2 blocks were made, one good, one bad.. the bad one costing the game.

Interestingly enough, I was in my name Silly Blocker :) and I have written in her profile a quote from my best friend Todd who is a Top 25 player:

"I'd like to shake the hand of the man, or kiss the woman who first introduced blocking to HW. If it wasn't for them, I wouldn't win half the games I do." ~ Todd aka mr toad

Oh the irony! :)

What I am trying to point out here is that a huge majority of blocks are totally unnecessary. It's very likely that there is a stopper present, as these two games have aptly shown.
I've sat in games where someone's blocking every other hand and are being congratuated for it, when indeed they are giving away points!

Teach us about blocking rightly. :)
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Post by cowboyschick » Fri Jun 01, 2007 3:55 pm

I've pretty much given up blockin and the reason is this...I stink at it. I always block when its not a loner and i miss the ones that are :oops: so now i jus do it if they are on 6 or 7 and were on 9 and thats jus to guarantee we get the deal back....tends to cut the frustration of realizing i've given a game away from overblocking...Great post Garry!!

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Post by callme7 » Fri Jun 01, 2007 5:24 pm

Wow this Blocking certainly is a stinker. As i said at the start of this thread, "i never used to block until i came to HW" the 1st year i never blocked once, but the 9s up game and my P changed me a little. Bonnie said to me one day, "why don't you Block G, my reply i think was, that it's too big a guess. You guys are right, it is so very hard to get right. I will block if a Bower is turned up for the opposition and i basically have a Loner in the 1st seat in the other colour, or a real stink hand with no Trump, but also we have to be in a position where it doesn't put the opposition in an unreal advantage. Stacey you hit it in one, the insurance block is a must because normally you will go out on your deal, i don't take that risk now, when we are 9 and they are 6 or 7 and if my hand is pathetic. The overblocking on here is very noticeable and 100s of games are lost to overblocking. Ok that's my last word on blocking LMAO, if ya gonna do it, don't let it cost you the game. If i had to make a choice about Blocking and Non Blocking i would give the non blocking the nod but a very well placed Block at a certain time of a game can reap a big reward. Try to defend against the Loner, i know that's not always possible. For the players that haven't seen the article by Joe Andrew's on page 2 of the Forum index go check it out, it's called leading a Singleton Ace into a Loner, 2 thirds the way down the page. Goooood Luck coz ya gonna need it. :D

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Post by callme7 » Fri Jun 01, 2007 5:28 pm

So sorry guys i Hiccupped again and posted twice, GrandmaS gonna kill me. :oops: :oops:

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Post by grandmaS » Fri Jun 01, 2007 5:33 pm

Hehe naw I will just use my magic spoon :)

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Post by callme7 » Tue Jun 05, 2007 11:31 pm

To Hoyle or not to Hoyle. It's simple really, don't knock it until you have tried it. I receive emails on a weekly basis about players not willing or having the knowledge or confidence to call their Partners hand, about 95% of these are with learner Ps. They just don't believe that you can put the odds in your favour. Let's just have a look at this. Forget the bagging and assume the calls are genuine. Remember that the 1st round of calling is based solely on the strength of your own hand whether you can order the dealer up or if you are the dealer, to pick it up. Ok the deal has been turned down (Spade) We assume by the dealer doing that, that they have no Black Bowers and are very light in that suit. We also assume the dealers P has little in spades as well because they never ordered the deal. Right Girls and Boys we have a dead suit. The call then comes to you in the 1st seat, HELP what do i do. It is a reasonably safe percentage bet that your P (3rd seat) has a couple of Clubs (Next) lurking in the woodwork. Even if you only have a one and only Club, make that Trump, don't go Red (Crossing) unless you are strong. I am sure alot of other players have done the Homework on "Next" but if the 1st seat blindly called next forever they would be successful about 60% of the time, check it out for yourself. I have mentioned this earlier but felt i should try and tell you why you should call "Next" most of the time. 2nd seat, dealers P, what's the bet they call Red, don't let them. I personally think that if you don't at least use Hoyle in this area your standard of play would be be very limited to say the least. Try this for size. If you are in the 1st or 2nd seat write down the calls you make on your own hands merit on that 2nd round of calling, and the calls you make for both you and your Partner taken into consideration. I know what will be in front over a year or so. Gl. :)

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Post by callme7 » Wed Jun 13, 2007 9:59 am

To the beginners who trump their Ps ace with a small trump when the opposition go alone, DON'T. Not in ordinary circumstances anyway. I have seen so much of this in the last couple of weeks with a Zero result. Your trump will be wasted unless you are loaded. The opposition will have to trump the ace anyway so why put a little trump on it, also they may have the suit your P led. You are not forcing them to play high, and this is the reason for doing this. If you have the Ace or Left Bower go for it as your P might have the one you haven't got and that would be the sure stopper, as the person going alone will have to use the right. (unless the Loner is an Andy, scroll back to earlier pages for the discription of an Andy Loner)
Also when making trump with the Right Bower and Ace only and you have no real offsuit it's a good ploy to keep the right guarded, ie. let your P take a trick 1st if you can, then try and get the lead back to your left side. If you unguard the right i bet when you use the Ace the left Bower will come out and clobber you, let the Ace and Right take two guarenteed tricks, ok not always possible but most of the time they do. I personally throw off until i get the lead back to my left. If this doesn't work ya P will fry ya for dinner. I am rarely set with these two cards. There are other ways of playing the hand, this is just one that works for me. :)

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Post by Euchre Buff » Sun Jun 17, 2007 8:48 am

i was playing some games today and i believe the players we played were cheating their Butts off. i think i played 5 games and we had the chance of about 6 loners with very good hands but their first lead stopped it everytime. Hesitation took place i believe everytime the lead was made. i hate saying that players are cheating but their leads throughout the game were very amazing to say the least. i know you said something on cheats earlier but is there anymore that hasnt been told to us. I dont play alot but really enjoy the site. i did replay the games and it looked a bit suspect to me with my limited knowledge of the game. maybe some more light can be thrown onto this by you or some other players.

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Post by callme7 » Tue Jun 19, 2007 7:44 am

In general "Buff" players don't cheat. In fact i watch a hell of alot of games on here and lately i can't find anyone that even looks like cheating. It is so damn easy to accuse players but at the end of the day when you check their Rating and win/loss ratio and they have not the best of either, it is very hard to call them cheats. As i said earlier in the thread, just because players call each others hand, that doesnt make them cheats, that makes them to me "Next" callers and understanding "Crossing the Creek" for their P. Over the years there have been alot of exceptional players on here been accused of cheating, the fact of the matter is they are just damn good callers that know when the opposition passes they dive in like hungry dogs and nail the call most of the time. I know alot of players worry about this but ask yourself this question. Have the players you thought were cheating worked their way up the ladder on a daily basis and reached the top? The answer to that 99% of the time is a big fat NO, normally the next day they are fighting for survival. There was one incident about two years ago where 20 Nics were playing each other on a daily basis and gradually worked themselves nearly to the top, another player and myself sniffed this out and found out it was one guy on two computers creating havoc. He didn't have a losing day on any of the nics for over six weeks, hell i would kill for that kind of luck. In the end Administration put an end to him. Five important things to look for if you think players are cheating (1) Stopping your loner on a continuous basis with their 1st lead. (2) perfect leading all the time. (3) Players calling their Ps hand all the time when not either a "Next" call or a "Creek" call. (4) Players logging on at the same time all the time within 10secs of each other, you can check this, could be one player. (5) Obvious stalling by both players. There are other things as well. NONE of these five things means a damn thing to me unless it was done for days on end by the same players, a few games with this happening means ZILCH. GL. :)

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Baluka
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Post by Baluka » Thu Jun 28, 2007 5:22 am

man this is like a network of worms. i been playin only a few weeks and reading all of this stuff makes the game seem complicated, but i see it is dang good for guys like me. why do so many players insist on there partners leading trump, hell even me can see that could be a stupid thing to do when your P does not have alot. good write up players thank y'all.
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Post by callme7 » Sun Jul 01, 2007 9:33 am

Lopsided Tables or even Tables. How do you really know when you are getting a Bum Stear. I for one over the last year have had very poor and uneven cards, you might say, hey how do you know that. Ok this is one very good guide on how to gauge if you are getting your fair share of the goodies or the baddies. I won't go into the last years results of mine but in the last seven weeks i have played 197 games, in those games i have had the deal 689 times, i was ordered up by my P 131 times (This is classed as being able to pick deal up) and was able to pick my deal up 311 times, this includes ordering my P. The opposition ordered the deal on me 247 times, i considered that 47 of these were blocks. I ordered the oppositions deal up 39 times, 18 were blocks. You just can't win at this game with those Statistics against you, that is how you can say that you are getting good cards or uneven ones. I call extremely thin so i consider there was no way that i could have picked any of the deals up that i turned down and once the hand was played out it was proven correct in 97% of the time. I played 6 games last week with a very good player on the site, she totally played the games by herself, i couldn't pick my deal up in any game infact i only did it 4 times in 6 games. We won the Match 4-2 on her ability to call my hand when she could. (An absolute must) I have not written this section to complain about getting bad cards it is written for assistance on being able to truthfully say you are getting good or bad cards and that you are able to guage it a little. There are a couple of other things to look for but in general this is a very good guide, hope this helps you guys a little who continually get the baddies. Now you really know you get them. :lol: :lol:

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Post by up a crk » Mon Jul 02, 2007 6:11 am

Karma :D

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